path: root/archives/extend/2013-August.txt

From fgallaire at gmail.com  Fri Aug  2 17:01:26 2013
From: fgallaire at gmail.com (Florent Gallaire)
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 17:01:26 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Mailing lists
Message-ID: <CAB9F1ceSGWQMLisLg67Hakg5BkEPEqNMgkwQhujV=9z_uE89vg@mail.gmail.com>

The extend projets are great and very popular, they need to have each
one a different mailing list.

And mailman has a really useless web interface.

Florent

-- 
FLOSS Engineer & Lawyer


From fgallaire at gmail.com  Fri Aug  2 17:06:42 2013
From: fgallaire at gmail.com (Florent Gallaire)
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 17:06:42 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Riak in Farwest
Message-ID: <CAB9F1ccXD0RMYrMeu1zOr=s638sWN4DBQcVLrn9Rk8_q+xWKKA@mail.gmail.com>

I love the farwest technical choices. But Riak seems to only be the
"prototype' database, and PostgreSQL the real target.

FMO, this is a huge fail. Riak is by far superior to PostgreSQL. I
want Riak, who really wants PostgresSQL ??

Florent

-- 
FLOSS Engineer & Lawyer


From essen at ninenines.eu  Fri Aug  2 17:08:47 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lo=EFc_Hoguin?=)
Date: Fri, 02 Aug 2013 17:08:47 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Riak in Farwest
In-Reply-To: <CAB9F1ccXD0RMYrMeu1zOr=s638sWN4DBQcVLrn9Rk8_q+xWKKA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB9F1ccXD0RMYrMeu1zOr=s638sWN4DBQcVLrn9Rk8_q+xWKKA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

Please tell us what you think makes Riak superior.

On 08/02/2013 05:06 PM, Florent Gallaire wrote:
> I love the farwest technical choices. But Riak seems to only be the
> "prototype' database, and PostgreSQL the real target.
>
> FMO, this is a huge fail. Riak is by far superior to PostgreSQL. I
> want Riak, who really wants PostgresSQL ??
>
> Florent
>


-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From essen at ninenines.eu  Fri Aug  2 17:09:58 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lo=EFc_Hoguin?=)
Date: Fri, 02 Aug 2013 17:09:58 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Mailing lists
In-Reply-To: <CAB9F1ceSGWQMLisLg67Hakg5BkEPEqNMgkwQhujV=9z_uE89vg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB9F1ceSGWQMLisLg67Hakg5BkEPEqNMgkwQhujV=9z_uE89vg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

On 08/02/2013 05:01 PM, Florent Gallaire wrote:
> The extend projets are great and very popular, they need to have each
> one a different mailing list.

That would be true if there was actual activity on the mailing lists. 
There isn't.

-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From fgallaire at gmail.com  Fri Aug  2 17:14:00 2013
From: fgallaire at gmail.com (Florent Gallaire)
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 17:14:00 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Mailing lists
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <CAB9F1ceSGWQMLisLg67Hakg5BkEPEqNMgkwQhujV=9z_uE89vg@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <CAB9F1cfDsMpoaD+YYGm+uErfqk1EM+piV4FN1KFOrdOGnB4BKA@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Aug 2, 2013 at 5:09 PM, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:
> On 08/02/2013 05:01 PM, Florent Gallaire wrote:
>>
>> The extend projets are great and very popular, they need to have each
>> one a different mailing list.
>
>
> That would be true if there was actual activity on the mailing lists. There
> isn't.

There is no activity because Mailman is useless.

Florent

-- 
FLOSS Engineer & Lawye


From lee.sylvester at gmail.com  Fri Aug  2 17:20:05 2013
From: lee.sylvester at gmail.com (Lee Sylvester)
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 16:20:05 +0100
Subject: [99s-extend] Riak in Farwest
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <CAB9F1ccXD0RMYrMeu1zOr=s638sWN4DBQcVLrn9Rk8_q+xWKKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

It's a bit like comparing sports cars to superbikes.  Riak has some very powerful features; Pipes, true clustering, fault tolerance, Riak CS etc.  Plus, it's built on Erlang :-)  PostgreSQL has SQL queries, real tables (rather than simple corruptible namespacing), complex query capabilities, real data types etc.  Each has their place.  For typical websites, PostgreSQL is the better choice.  For distributed applications, Riak is often the better choice. ***

Lee 

*** Mostly my opinion, only.



On 2 Aug 2013, at 16:08, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:

> Please tell us what you think makes Riak superior.
> 
> On 08/02/2013 05:06 PM, Florent Gallaire wrote:
>> I love the farwest technical choices. But Riak seems to only be the
>> "prototype' database, and PostgreSQL the real target.
>> 
>> FMO, this is a huge fail. Riak is by far superior to PostgreSQL. I
>> want Riak, who really wants PostgresSQL ??
>> 
>> Florent
>> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Lo?c Hoguin
> Erlang Cowboy
> Nine Nines
> http://ninenines.eu
> _______________________________________________
> Extend mailing list
> Extend at lists.ninenines.eu
> http://lists.ninenines.eu:81/listinfo/extend



From essen at ninenines.eu  Fri Aug  2 17:21:39 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lo=EFc_Hoguin?=)
Date: Fri, 02 Aug 2013 17:21:39 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Mailing lists
In-Reply-To: <CAB9F1cfDsMpoaD+YYGm+uErfqk1EM+piV4FN1KFOrdOGnB4BKA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB9F1ceSGWQMLisLg67Hakg5BkEPEqNMgkwQhujV=9z_uE89vg@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cfDsMpoaD+YYGm+uErfqk1EM+piV4FN1KFOrdOGnB4BKA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

On 08/02/2013 05:14 PM, Florent Gallaire wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 2, 2013 at 5:09 PM, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:
>> On 08/02/2013 05:01 PM, Florent Gallaire wrote:
>>>
>>> The extend projets are great and very popular, they need to have each
>>> one a different mailing list.
>>
>>
>> That would be true if there was actual activity on the mailing lists. There
>> isn't.
>
> There is no activity because Mailman is useless.

I said no activity, I didn't say no members. Please keep your complaints 
about the tool down, it's got nothing to do with it, and you just end up 
spamming people here.

All development happens on IRC, so this leaves the mailing lists only 
useful for questions, which should be rarer over time considering the 
docs keep improving and the archives provide great answers for the rest. 
It's all good.

-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From fgallaire at gmail.com  Fri Aug  2 17:25:22 2013
From: fgallaire at gmail.com (Florent Gallaire)
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 17:25:22 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Riak in Farwest
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <CAB9F1ccXD0RMYrMeu1zOr=s638sWN4DBQcVLrn9Rk8_q+xWKKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <CAB9F1cdo2SLt2hdtjik1RtXPRGOQAxVEdr2Nxyx_06L=dbybJg@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Aug 2, 2013 at 5:08 PM, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:
> Please tell us what you think makes Riak superior.

Riak is written in Erlang. See your own argumentations on why Erlang
is the best langage to program high load/fault-tolerent web software.

Riak is written in Erlang, as all the 99 other soft -> good
integration of the whole.

Riak is a NoSQL Dynamo database with Availability and Partition
tolerance, and this is what I want for my web applications. PostgreSQL
is a SQL Availability and Consistency old school database.

Riak is just what want a developer who use erlang to have a scaling platform.

Florent

-- 
FLOSS Engineer & Lawyer


From Kevin.Brown at turner.com  Fri Aug  2 17:29:35 2013
From: Kevin.Brown at turner.com (Brown, Kevin)
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 15:29:35 +0000
Subject: [99s-extend] Riak in Farwest
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <CAB9F1ccXD0RMYrMeu1zOr=s638sWN4DBQcVLrn9Rk8_q+xWKKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>,
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

Postgres has been made to scale well in GIS applications.  Apple is using Postgres for their current Maps geo point storage.  

On Aug 2, 2013, at 11:20 AM, "Lee Sylvester" <lee.sylvester at gmail.com> wrote:

> It's a bit like comparing sports cars to superbikes.  Riak has some very powerful features; Pipes, true clustering, fault tolerance, Riak CS etc.  Plus, it's built on Erlang :-)  PostgreSQL has SQL queries, real tables (rather than simple corruptible namespacing), complex query capabilities, real data types etc.  Each has their place.  For typical websites, PostgreSQL is the better choice.  For distributed applications, Riak is often the better choice. ***
> 
> Lee 
> 
> *** Mostly my opinion, only.
> 
> 
> 
> On 2 Aug 2013, at 16:08, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:
> 
>> Please tell us what you think makes Riak superior.
>> 
>> On 08/02/2013 05:06 PM, Florent Gallaire wrote:
>>> I love the farwest technical choices. But Riak seems to only be the
>>> "prototype' database, and PostgreSQL the real target.
>>> 
>>> FMO, this is a huge fail. Riak is by far superior to PostgreSQL. I
>>> want Riak, who really wants PostgresSQL ??
>>> 
>>> Florent
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> Lo?c Hoguin
>> Erlang Cowboy
>> Nine Nines
>> http://ninenines.eu
>> _______________________________________________
>> Extend mailing list
>> Extend at lists.ninenines.eu
>> http://lists.ninenines.eu:81/listinfo/extend
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Extend mailing list
> Extend at lists.ninenines.eu
> http://lists.ninenines.eu:81/listinfo/extend
> 



From fgallaire at gmail.com  Fri Aug  2 17:33:32 2013
From: fgallaire at gmail.com (Florent Gallaire)
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 17:33:32 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Mailing lists
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <CAB9F1ceSGWQMLisLg67Hakg5BkEPEqNMgkwQhujV=9z_uE89vg@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cfDsMpoaD+YYGm+uErfqk1EM+piV4FN1KFOrdOGnB4BKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <CAB9F1ce6aVHGpNsSwApUGOyPGgruMsRrrZvWJc=EsqQE6Rae5g@mail.gmail.com>

> I said no activity, I didn't say no members. Please keep your complaints
> about the tool down, it's got nothing to do with it, and you just end up
> spamming people here.
>
> All development happens on IRC, so this leaves the mailing lists only useful
> for questions, which should be rarer over time considering the docs keep
> improving and the archives provide great answers for the rest. It's all
> good.

I don't agree. More you have users, more you should have questions on
the mailing list, even if the documentation is improving.

I'm on the mailing lists of **a lot** of free software with great
documentations, and they are very active.

Where is the history of the choices/debates made on IRC ?

Florent

-- 
FLOSS Engineer & Lawyer


From lee.sylvester at gmail.com  Fri Aug  2 17:33:53 2013
From: lee.sylvester at gmail.com (Lee Sylvester)
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 16:33:53 +0100
Subject: [99s-extend] Riak in Farwest
In-Reply-To: <CAB9F1cdo2SLt2hdtjik1RtXPRGOQAxVEdr2Nxyx_06L=dbybJg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB9F1ccXD0RMYrMeu1zOr=s638sWN4DBQcVLrn9Rk8_q+xWKKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cdo2SLt2hdtjik1RtXPRGOQAxVEdr2Nxyx_06L=dbybJg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

NoSQL is a trend, but is often not the best choice for data storage.  The reason it has had a strong revival recently (no, NoSQL is not a new thing) is because it is simpler for non-SQL developers to jump into and requires less thought on structuring your data.  However, there are many scenarios where NoSQL is a bad choice.  For example, I would certainly hope my bank doesn't log my transactions using NoSQL!

Lee




On 2 Aug 2013, at 16:25, Florent Gallaire <fgallaire at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Fri, Aug 2, 2013 at 5:08 PM, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:
>> Please tell us what you think makes Riak superior.
> 
> Riak is written in Erlang. See your own argumentations on why Erlang
> is the best langage to program high load/fault-tolerent web software.
> 
> Riak is written in Erlang, as all the 99 other soft -> good
> integration of the whole.
> 
> Riak is a NoSQL Dynamo database with Availability and Partition
> tolerance, and this is what I want for my web applications. PostgreSQL
> is a SQL Availability and Consistency old school database.
> 
> Riak is just what want a developer who use erlang to have a scaling platform.
> 
> Florent
> 
> -- 
> FLOSS Engineer & Lawyer
> _______________________________________________
> Extend mailing list
> Extend at lists.ninenines.eu
> http://lists.ninenines.eu:81/listinfo/extend



From essen at ninenines.eu  Fri Aug  2 17:35:13 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lo=EFc_Hoguin?=)
Date: Fri, 02 Aug 2013 17:35:13 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Riak in Farwest
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <CAB9F1ccXD0RMYrMeu1zOr=s638sWN4DBQcVLrn9Rk8_q+xWKKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

Let me clarify a few misconceptions here. (Mostly to show the choice 
isn't random, don't take it wrong.)

Riak and Riak CS are two different things. You most likely don't want to 
run them together, especially considering the hardware requirements will 
differ.

Riak core, pipes, etc. are not really useful if you only use Riak as a 
data store. It's cool that your DB has a great distributed processing 
framework but pretty useless when you just want to retrieve some data 
and format it in a web page.

Riak has clustering, yes. PostgreSQL has clustering too.

Riak has data-center aware clustering also if you get Riak Enterprise. 
But it costs a lot (per node!). You can do the same with PostgreSQL at a 
fraction of the price.

Riak is built on Erlang, sure. But why should I care? I only want it to 
handle my data. I don't want to look at the code. PostgreSQL is a much 
proven piece of software.

On 08/02/2013 05:20 PM, Lee Sylvester wrote:
> It's a bit like comparing sports cars to superbikes.  Riak has some very powerful features; Pipes, true clustering, fault tolerance, Riak CS etc.  Plus, it's built on Erlang :-)  PostgreSQL has SQL queries, real tables (rather than simple corruptible namespacing), complex query capabilities, real data types etc.  Each has their place.  For typical websites, PostgreSQL is the better choice.  For distributed applications, Riak is often the better choice. ***
>
> Lee
>
> *** Mostly my opinion, only.
>
>
>
> On 2 Aug 2013, at 16:08, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:
>
>> Please tell us what you think makes Riak superior.
>>
>> On 08/02/2013 05:06 PM, Florent Gallaire wrote:
>>> I love the farwest technical choices. But Riak seems to only be the
>>> "prototype' database, and PostgreSQL the real target.
>>>
>>> FMO, this is a huge fail. Riak is by far superior to PostgreSQL. I
>>> want Riak, who really wants PostgresSQL ??
>>>
>>> Florent
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Lo?c Hoguin
>> Erlang Cowboy
>> Nine Nines
>> http://ninenines.eu
>> _______________________________________________
>> Extend mailing list
>> Extend at lists.ninenines.eu
>> http://lists.ninenines.eu:81/listinfo/extend
>


-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From fgallaire at gmail.com  Fri Aug  2 17:35:58 2013
From: fgallaire at gmail.com (Florent Gallaire)
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 17:35:58 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Riak in Farwest
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <CAB9F1ccXD0RMYrMeu1zOr=s638sWN4DBQcVLrn9Rk8_q+xWKKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cdo2SLt2hdtjik1RtXPRGOQAxVEdr2Nxyx_06L=dbybJg@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <CAB9F1cdp2DwdhvFre+y0AMrugmvOvUB3GLY6T7AczzRG3aZLTg@mail.gmail.com>

> For example, I would certainly hope my bank doesn't log my transactions using NoSQL!

You're right, but is Farwest designed to develop banf software ? I
don't think so.

Florent

-- 
FLOSS Engineer & Lawyer


From fgallaire at gmail.com  Fri Aug  2 17:39:04 2013
From: fgallaire at gmail.com (Florent Gallaire)
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 17:39:04 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Riak in Farwest
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <CAB9F1ccXD0RMYrMeu1zOr=s638sWN4DBQcVLrn9Rk8_q+xWKKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <CAB9F1cc0e+DqtTUW-YKEBW2LjF7b3i2Q0vbawDPoDuMB4P3CEQ@mail.gmail.com>

> PostgreSQL is a much proven piece of software.

Ouch !! And Apache is a much proven piece of software than cowboy, why
don't use it for Farwest ?

Florent


-- 
FLOSS Engineer & Lawyer


From essen at ninenines.eu  Fri Aug  2 17:39:58 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lo=EFc_Hoguin?=)
Date: Fri, 02 Aug 2013 17:39:58 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Riak in Farwest
In-Reply-To: <CAB9F1cdo2SLt2hdtjik1RtXPRGOQAxVEdr2Nxyx_06L=dbybJg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB9F1ccXD0RMYrMeu1zOr=s638sWN4DBQcVLrn9Rk8_q+xWKKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cdo2SLt2hdtjik1RtXPRGOQAxVEdr2Nxyx_06L=dbybJg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

On 08/02/2013 05:25 PM, Florent Gallaire wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 2, 2013 at 5:08 PM, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:
>> Please tell us what you think makes Riak superior.
>
> Riak is written in Erlang. See your own argumentations on why Erlang
> is the best langage to program high load/fault-tolerent web software.
 >
> Riak is written in Erlang, as all the 99 other soft -> good
> integration of the whole.

See the post I just sent. I have no reason to care about the language 
here. It's not going to run in the same node. I'm not going to look at 
it. And PostgreSQL is a much proven software, much more than Riak who's 
had issues with the Erlang schedulers and more and is still young.

> Riak is a NoSQL Dynamo database with Availability and Partition
> tolerance, and this is what I want for my web applications. PostgreSQL
> is a SQL Availability and Consistency old school database.

The need for partitioning comes a *lot* later for SQL databases. They 
can deal with big amounts of data just fine. And Farwest is made for 
small to medium applications, therefore the issue will likely never come 
up until Farwest itself becomes the issue.

> Riak is just what want a developer who use erlang to have a scaling platform.

This is the first time I hear complaints about choosing PostgreSQL.

-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From essen at ninenines.eu  Fri Aug  2 17:41:39 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lo=EFc_Hoguin?=)
Date: Fri, 02 Aug 2013 17:41:39 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Riak in Farwest
In-Reply-To: <CAB9F1cc0e+DqtTUW-YKEBW2LjF7b3i2Q0vbawDPoDuMB4P3CEQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB9F1ccXD0RMYrMeu1zOr=s638sWN4DBQcVLrn9Rk8_q+xWKKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cc0e+DqtTUW-YKEBW2LjF7b3i2Q0vbawDPoDuMB4P3CEQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

On 08/02/2013 05:39 PM, Florent Gallaire wrote:
>> PostgreSQL is a much proven piece of software.
>
> Ouch !! And Apache is a much proven piece of software than cowboy, why
> don't use it for Farwest ?

Because CGI, PHP, Perl, ... aren't. But you can put Apache in front of 
Farwest just fine if you need to.

-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From lee.sylvester at gmail.com  Fri Aug  2 17:43:49 2013
From: lee.sylvester at gmail.com (Lee Sylvester)
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 16:43:49 +0100
Subject: [99s-extend] Riak in Farwest
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <CAB9F1ccXD0RMYrMeu1zOr=s638sWN4DBQcVLrn9Rk8_q+xWKKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

Hey, don't direct that at me :-S  I was agreeing with you :-D

The only point I would differ with (and I may be wrong, as it was about 12 months ago that I researched this) is that I do feel, for clustering, that Riak does it better.  I'd much rather the dynamo model than a master-to-many slaves model.

Lee



On 2 Aug 2013, at 16:35, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:

> Let me clarify a few misconceptions here. (Mostly to show the choice isn't random, don't take it wrong.)
> 
> Riak and Riak CS are two different things. You most likely don't want to run them together, especially considering the hardware requirements will differ.
> 
> Riak core, pipes, etc. are not really useful if you only use Riak as a data store. It's cool that your DB has a great distributed processing framework but pretty useless when you just want to retrieve some data and format it in a web page.
> 
> Riak has clustering, yes. PostgreSQL has clustering too.
> 
> Riak has data-center aware clustering also if you get Riak Enterprise. But it costs a lot (per node!). You can do the same with PostgreSQL at a fraction of the price.
> 
> Riak is built on Erlang, sure. But why should I care? I only want it to handle my data. I don't want to look at the code. PostgreSQL is a much proven piece of software.
> 
> On 08/02/2013 05:20 PM, Lee Sylvester wrote:
>> It's a bit like comparing sports cars to superbikes.  Riak has some very powerful features; Pipes, true clustering, fault tolerance, Riak CS etc.  Plus, it's built on Erlang :-)  PostgreSQL has SQL queries, real tables (rather than simple corruptible namespacing), complex query capabilities, real data types etc.  Each has their place.  For typical websites, PostgreSQL is the better choice.  For distributed applications, Riak is often the better choice. ***
>> 
>> Lee
>> 
>> *** Mostly my opinion, only.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On 2 Aug 2013, at 16:08, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:
>> 
>>> Please tell us what you think makes Riak superior.
>>> 
>>> On 08/02/2013 05:06 PM, Florent Gallaire wrote:
>>>> I love the farwest technical choices. But Riak seems to only be the
>>>> "prototype' database, and PostgreSQL the real target.
>>>> 
>>>> FMO, this is a huge fail. Riak is by far superior to PostgreSQL. I
>>>> want Riak, who really wants PostgresSQL ??
>>>> 
>>>> Florent
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Lo?c Hoguin
>>> Erlang Cowboy
>>> Nine Nines
>>> http://ninenines.eu
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Extend mailing list
>>> Extend at lists.ninenines.eu
>>> http://lists.ninenines.eu:81/listinfo/extend
>> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Lo?c Hoguin
> Erlang Cowboy
> Nine Nines
> http://ninenines.eu



From essen at ninenines.eu  Fri Aug  2 17:45:07 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lo=EFc_Hoguin?=)
Date: Fri, 02 Aug 2013 17:45:07 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Mailing lists
In-Reply-To: <CAB9F1ce6aVHGpNsSwApUGOyPGgruMsRrrZvWJc=EsqQE6Rae5g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB9F1ceSGWQMLisLg67Hakg5BkEPEqNMgkwQhujV=9z_uE89vg@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cfDsMpoaD+YYGm+uErfqk1EM+piV4FN1KFOrdOGnB4BKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1ce6aVHGpNsSwApUGOyPGgruMsRrrZvWJc=EsqQE6Rae5g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

On 08/02/2013 05:33 PM, Florent Gallaire wrote:
> Where is the history of the choices/debates made on IRC ?

No such thing. No need for it either, the choices tend to change a few 
times until things stabilize.

-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From fgallaire at gmail.com  Fri Aug  2 17:46:53 2013
From: fgallaire at gmail.com (Florent Gallaire)
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 17:46:53 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Riak in Farwest
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <CAB9F1ccXD0RMYrMeu1zOr=s638sWN4DBQcVLrn9Rk8_q+xWKKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <CAB9F1cco6H-t=L6FXu1aa6O5opNVoVqAZbm2a=eRxAp+GD+awA@mail.gmail.com>

> The only point I would differ with (and I may be wrong, as it was about 12 months ago that I researched this) is that I do feel, for clustering, that Riak does it better.  I'd much rather the dynamo model than a master-to-many slaves model.

Yes you're right, all clustering are far to be equal. Dynamo is really
great, and master-to-master is just an archaic way to do things you
don't really know to do.

Florent

-- 
FLOSS Engineer & Lawyer


From essen at ninenines.eu  Fri Aug  2 17:47:39 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lo=EFc_Hoguin?=)
Date: Fri, 02 Aug 2013 17:47:39 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Riak in Farwest
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <CAB9F1ccXD0RMYrMeu1zOr=s638sWN4DBQcVLrn9Rk8_q+xWKKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

I know, hence the "don't take it wrong".

You have a few different projects enabling multi-master replication for 
PostgreSQL. It's not an issue.

On 08/02/2013 05:43 PM, Lee Sylvester wrote:
> Hey, don't direct that at me :-S  I was agreeing with you :-D
>
> The only point I would differ with (and I may be wrong, as it was about 12 months ago that I researched this) is that I do feel, for clustering, that Riak does it better.  I'd much rather the dynamo model than a master-to-many slaves model.
>
> Lee
>
>
>
> On 2 Aug 2013, at 16:35, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:
>
>> Let me clarify a few misconceptions here. (Mostly to show the choice isn't random, don't take it wrong.)
>>
>> Riak and Riak CS are two different things. You most likely don't want to run them together, especially considering the hardware requirements will differ.
>>
>> Riak core, pipes, etc. are not really useful if you only use Riak as a data store. It's cool that your DB has a great distributed processing framework but pretty useless when you just want to retrieve some data and format it in a web page.
>>
>> Riak has clustering, yes. PostgreSQL has clustering too.
>>
>> Riak has data-center aware clustering also if you get Riak Enterprise. But it costs a lot (per node!). You can do the same with PostgreSQL at a fraction of the price.
>>
>> Riak is built on Erlang, sure. But why should I care? I only want it to handle my data. I don't want to look at the code. PostgreSQL is a much proven piece of software.
>>
>> On 08/02/2013 05:20 PM, Lee Sylvester wrote:
>>> It's a bit like comparing sports cars to superbikes.  Riak has some very powerful features; Pipes, true clustering, fault tolerance, Riak CS etc.  Plus, it's built on Erlang :-)  PostgreSQL has SQL queries, real tables (rather than simple corruptible namespacing), complex query capabilities, real data types etc.  Each has their place.  For typical websites, PostgreSQL is the better choice.  For distributed applications, Riak is often the better choice. ***
>>>
>>> Lee
>>>
>>> *** Mostly my opinion, only.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 2 Aug 2013, at 16:08, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Please tell us what you think makes Riak superior.
>>>>
>>>> On 08/02/2013 05:06 PM, Florent Gallaire wrote:
>>>>> I love the farwest technical choices. But Riak seems to only be the
>>>>> "prototype' database, and PostgreSQL the real target.
>>>>>
>>>>> FMO, this is a huge fail. Riak is by far superior to PostgreSQL. I
>>>>> want Riak, who really wants PostgresSQL ??
>>>>>
>>>>> Florent
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Lo?c Hoguin
>>>> Erlang Cowboy
>>>> Nine Nines
>>>> http://ninenines.eu
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Extend mailing list
>>>> Extend at lists.ninenines.eu
>>>> http://lists.ninenines.eu:81/listinfo/extend
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Lo?c Hoguin
>> Erlang Cowboy
>> Nine Nines
>> http://ninenines.eu
>


-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From fgallaire at gmail.com  Fri Aug  2 17:49:00 2013
From: fgallaire at gmail.com (Florent Gallaire)
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 17:49:00 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Mailing lists
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <CAB9F1ceSGWQMLisLg67Hakg5BkEPEqNMgkwQhujV=9z_uE89vg@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cfDsMpoaD+YYGm+uErfqk1EM+piV4FN1KFOrdOGnB4BKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1ce6aVHGpNsSwApUGOyPGgruMsRrrZvWJc=EsqQE6Rae5g@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <CAB9F1ccF7aY92-00nZYJuzyu+xYbme6zeHv_9kt_Oj4FLJhooA@mail.gmail.com>

> No such thing. No need for it either, the choices tend to change a few times
> until things stabilize.

This is a really wrong way. Free software needs public transparency.

Florent

-- 
FLOSS Engineer & Lawyer


From essen at ninenines.eu  Fri Aug  2 17:50:32 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lo=EFc_Hoguin?=)
Date: Fri, 02 Aug 2013 17:50:32 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Mailing lists
In-Reply-To: <CAB9F1ccF7aY92-00nZYJuzyu+xYbme6zeHv_9kt_Oj4FLJhooA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB9F1ceSGWQMLisLg67Hakg5BkEPEqNMgkwQhujV=9z_uE89vg@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cfDsMpoaD+YYGm+uErfqk1EM+piV4FN1KFOrdOGnB4BKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1ce6aVHGpNsSwApUGOyPGgruMsRrrZvWJc=EsqQE6Rae5g@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1ccF7aY92-00nZYJuzyu+xYbme6zeHv_9kt_Oj4FLJhooA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

On 08/02/2013 05:49 PM, Florent Gallaire wrote:
>> No such thing. No need for it either, the choices tend to change a few times
>> until things stabilize.
>
> This is a really wrong way. Free software needs public transparency.

The regular contributors don't seem to complain.

-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From tristan.sloughter at gmail.com  Fri Aug  2 17:52:17 2013
From: tristan.sloughter at gmail.com (Tristan Sloughter)
Date: Fri, 02 Aug 2013 08:52:17 -0700
Subject: [99s-extend] Mailing lists
In-Reply-To: <CAB9F1ccF7aY92-00nZYJuzyu+xYbme6zeHv_9kt_Oj4FLJhooA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB9F1ceSGWQMLisLg67Hakg5BkEPEqNMgkwQhujV=9z_uE89vg@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cfDsMpoaD+YYGm+uErfqk1EM+piV4FN1KFOrdOGnB4BKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1ce6aVHGpNsSwApUGOyPGgruMsRrrZvWJc=EsqQE6Rae5g@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1ccF7aY92-00nZYJuzyu+xYbme6zeHv_9kt_Oj4FLJhooA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

Public transparency like a public IRC channel anyone can join and log?

On Fri, Aug 2, 2013, at 08:49 AM, Florent Gallaire wrote:
> > No such thing. No need for it either, the choices tend to change a few times
> > until things stabilize.
> 
> This is a really wrong way. Free software needs public transparency.
> 
> Florent
> 
> -- 
> FLOSS Engineer & Lawyer
> _______________________________________________
> Extend mailing list
> Extend at lists.ninenines.eu
> http://lists.ninenines.eu:81/listinfo/extend


From fgallaire at gmail.com  Fri Aug  2 17:54:34 2013
From: fgallaire at gmail.com (Florent Gallaire)
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 17:54:34 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Mailing lists
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <CAB9F1ceSGWQMLisLg67Hakg5BkEPEqNMgkwQhujV=9z_uE89vg@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cfDsMpoaD+YYGm+uErfqk1EM+piV4FN1KFOrdOGnB4BKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1ce6aVHGpNsSwApUGOyPGgruMsRrrZvWJc=EsqQE6Rae5g@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1ccF7aY92-00nZYJuzyu+xYbme6zeHv_9kt_Oj4FLJhooA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <CAB9F1cdfRBtfAYzu99hOt9OKsv7MpVMyAPLmmpA_Bazqfp3W8A@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Aug 2, 2013 at 5:52 PM, Tristan Sloughter
<tristan.sloughter at gmail.com> wrote:
> Public transparency like a public IRC channel anyone can join and log?

Haha, what a joke. It's a pity you don't understand that.

Florent

-- 
FLOSS Engineer & Lawyer


From tristan.sloughter at gmail.com  Fri Aug  2 17:54:38 2013
From: tristan.sloughter at gmail.com (Tristan Sloughter)
Date: Fri, 02 Aug 2013 08:54:38 -0700
Subject: [99s-extend] Riak in Farwest
In-Reply-To: <CAB9F1ccXD0RMYrMeu1zOr=s638sWN4DBQcVLrn9Rk8_q+xWKKA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB9F1ccXD0RMYrMeu1zOr=s638sWN4DBQcVLrn9Rk8_q+xWKKA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

Me for one. Rarely have a use case that fits Riak but daily have use
cases that fit a RDBMS, and Postgres is the best of those in my opinion.

On Fri, Aug 2, 2013, at 08:06 AM, Florent Gallaire wrote:
> I love the farwest technical choices. But Riak seems to only be the
> "prototype' database, and PostgreSQL the real target.
> 
> FMO, this is a huge fail. Riak is by far superior to PostgreSQL. I
> want Riak, who really wants PostgresSQL ??
> 
> Florent
> 
> -- 
> FLOSS Engineer & Lawyer
> _______________________________________________
> Extend mailing list
> Extend at lists.ninenines.eu
> http://lists.ninenines.eu:81/listinfo/extend


From jeremy at quarkgames.com  Fri Aug  2 21:33:59 2013
From: jeremy at quarkgames.com (Jeremy Ong)
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 12:33:59 -0700
Subject: [99s-extend] Mailing lists
In-Reply-To: <CAB9F1cdfRBtfAYzu99hOt9OKsv7MpVMyAPLmmpA_Bazqfp3W8A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB9F1ceSGWQMLisLg67Hakg5BkEPEqNMgkwQhujV=9z_uE89vg@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cfDsMpoaD+YYGm+uErfqk1EM+piV4FN1KFOrdOGnB4BKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1ce6aVHGpNsSwApUGOyPGgruMsRrrZvWJc=EsqQE6Rae5g@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1ccF7aY92-00nZYJuzyu+xYbme6zeHv_9kt_Oj4FLJhooA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cdfRBtfAYzu99hOt9OKsv7MpVMyAPLmmpA_Bazqfp3W8A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAKD1GY56gKubvDkz911s9a47Bnu-YxGk48xJfe0DkpitfbwH3g@mail.gmail.com>

Florent, I suggest you actually contribute something before telling
the project maintainer how to run things and flaming people who *have*
contributed.

On Fri, Aug 2, 2013 at 8:54 AM, Florent Gallaire <fgallaire at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 2, 2013 at 5:52 PM, Tristan Sloughter
> <tristan.sloughter at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Public transparency like a public IRC channel anyone can join and log?
>
> Haha, what a joke. It's a pity you don't understand that.
>
> Florent
>
> --
> FLOSS Engineer & Lawyer
> _______________________________________________
> Extend mailing list
> Extend at lists.ninenines.eu
> http://lists.ninenines.eu:81/listinfo/extend


From edgurgel at gmail.com  Fri Aug  2 21:57:22 2013
From: edgurgel at gmail.com (Eduardo Gurgel)
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2013 16:57:22 -0300
Subject: [99s-extend] Fwd:  Mailing lists
In-Reply-To: <CAKAMJXjcwWJf7STqau=ghbsnnZRmobOSqxD9fjrrkgETu+v9Kw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB9F1ceSGWQMLisLg67Hakg5BkEPEqNMgkwQhujV=9z_uE89vg@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cfDsMpoaD+YYGm+uErfqk1EM+piV4FN1KFOrdOGnB4BKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1ce6aVHGpNsSwApUGOyPGgruMsRrrZvWJc=EsqQE6Rae5g@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1ccF7aY92-00nZYJuzyu+xYbme6zeHv_9kt_Oj4FLJhooA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cdfRBtfAYzu99hOt9OKsv7MpVMyAPLmmpA_Bazqfp3W8A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKD1GY56gKubvDkz911s9a47Bnu-YxGk48xJfe0DkpitfbwH3g@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKAMJXjcwWJf7STqau=ghbsnnZRmobOSqxD9fjrrkgETu+v9Kw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAKAMJXhSdYePQz55u5Hw6E1Qk-Je_o+ydP4vC+Yma=u=tBy4Jw@mail.gmail.com>

Forgot to reply to all

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Eduardo Gurgel <edgurgel at gmail.com>
Date: Fri, Aug 2, 2013 at 4:57 PM
Subject: Re: [99s-extend] Mailing lists
To: Jeremy Ong <jeremy at quarkgames.com>




On Fri, Aug 2, 2013 at 4:33 PM, Jeremy Ong <jeremy at quarkgames.com> wrote:

> Florent, I suggest you actually contribute something before telling
> the project maintainer how to run things and flaming people who *have*
> contributed.
>

Agreed.

Too much pointing finger on this thread...

-- 
Eduardo



-- 
Eduardo
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From fgallaire at gmail.com  Sat Aug  3 00:16:30 2013
From: fgallaire at gmail.com (Florent Gallaire)
Date: Sat, 3 Aug 2013 00:16:30 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Mailing lists
In-Reply-To: <CAKD1GY56gKubvDkz911s9a47Bnu-YxGk48xJfe0DkpitfbwH3g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB9F1ceSGWQMLisLg67Hakg5BkEPEqNMgkwQhujV=9z_uE89vg@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cfDsMpoaD+YYGm+uErfqk1EM+piV4FN1KFOrdOGnB4BKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1ce6aVHGpNsSwApUGOyPGgruMsRrrZvWJc=EsqQE6Rae5g@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1ccF7aY92-00nZYJuzyu+xYbme6zeHv_9kt_Oj4FLJhooA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cdfRBtfAYzu99hOt9OKsv7MpVMyAPLmmpA_Bazqfp3W8A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKD1GY56gKubvDkz911s9a47Bnu-YxGk48xJfe0DkpitfbwH3g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAB9F1cfpRX=WnK79_Q5s+hsW-uuybujnuqt6TeBcSXp5TbiLsg@mail.gmail.com>

> Florent, I suggest you actually contribute something before telling
> the project maintainer how to run things and flaming people who *have*
> contributed.

Jeremy, I tried to test farwest very early :
https://github.com/extend/farwest/pull/4

My "bad idee" of a server-sent events handler is now part of bullet :
https://github.com/extend/bullet/issues/16

Jeremy, maybe I haven't contribute something on this project because :
- I spend a lot of time working as a lawyer
- I spend a lot of time working on other free software
- I'm not yet a great Erlang programmer

AND

- There's no visibility on what is really doing, and who is doing it,
and why, and how it's decided. So I can't lose more time on that
because I can't know what is happened and what will happen.

I flame nobody. I give the 2 cents of help I can give. This is a
contribution. You can think it's useless, but I don't think so.

In free software, if you want a great success, you should be more open
that just have a free software licence.
You should do the life easier for the people interested in this
project and who want to help. You can think it's not a problem, but I
think it is. Is that a flame ?

Florent

FLOSS Engineer & Lawyer


From essen at ninenines.eu  Sat Aug  3 09:13:50 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lo=EFc_Hoguin?=)
Date: Sat, 03 Aug 2013 09:13:50 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] Mailing lists
In-Reply-To: <CAB9F1cfpRX=WnK79_Q5s+hsW-uuybujnuqt6TeBcSXp5TbiLsg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB9F1ceSGWQMLisLg67Hakg5BkEPEqNMgkwQhujV=9z_uE89vg@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cfDsMpoaD+YYGm+uErfqk1EM+piV4FN1KFOrdOGnB4BKA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1ce6aVHGpNsSwApUGOyPGgruMsRrrZvWJc=EsqQE6Rae5g@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1ccF7aY92-00nZYJuzyu+xYbme6zeHv_9kt_Oj4FLJhooA@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAB9F1cdfRBtfAYzu99hOt9OKsv7MpVMyAPLmmpA_Bazqfp3W8A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKD1GY56gKubvDkz911s9a47Bnu-YxGk48xJfe0DkpitfbwH3g@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAB9F1cfpRX=WnK79_Q5s+hsW-uuybujnuqt6TeBcSXp5TbiLsg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

On 08/03/2013 12:16 AM, Florent Gallaire wrote:
> - There's no visibility on what is really doing, and who is doing it,
> and why, and how it's decided. So I can't lose more time on that
> because I can't know what is happened and what will happen.

Or, you know, you could just open a ticket or ask like anyone else, 
preferrably the former. Chances are whatever you're thinking of doing 
has no chance of being merged at all, or could be interesting but only 
if certain implementation details are respected, or needs to involve 
other people.

Even if we did put more info on who does what, this still wouldn't 
remove the necessity for you to ask if you want to avoid losing your time.

-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From thebullno1 at gmail.com  Mon Aug  5 07:38:04 2013
From: thebullno1 at gmail.com (Bach Le)
Date: Mon, 5 Aug 2013 13:38:04 +0800
Subject: [99s-extend] Mailing lists
Message-ID: <CAG=BNYp2-Z04DZhXYDqEANBm=PS5CLzOCbGQD8k3JbTFr0Dawg@mail.gmail.com>

>You can think it's not a problem, but Ithink it is. Is that a flame ?
This is a flame:
> Haha, what a joke. It's a pity you don't understand that.

I for one, prefer Postgres. Not everything can be mapped to kv and that's
the only thing Riak is good for. It's not fit for a general purpose
database.
To me, NoSQL is about specialization. Each db excels at one type of
operation (and then there's mongo, but that's for another time), while
RDBMSs offer general purpose solutions. I begin my projects with an RDBMS
(usually Postgres) and when a particular piece of data is the bottleneck, I
move it to the appropriate NoSQL db.
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From essen at ninenines.eu  Wed Aug 14 19:50:18 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lo=EFc_Hoguin?=)
Date: Wed, 14 Aug 2013 19:50:18 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] [ANN] Farwest 0.3.0
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

It's finally here!

  *  https://github.com/extend/farwest/

It's still a mess in the two other repositories so I recommend waiting 
before digging in too much. This is just a direct port of the prototype 
to a more workable build suite and repository structure.

  *  https://github.com/extend/farwest_core/
  *  https://github.com/extend/farwest_ui/

A lot of work will be done on farwest_core next, while at the same time 
the frontend dude takes care of making the UI good.

Enjoy!

-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From essen at ninenines.eu  Thu Aug 15 16:19:42 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lo=EFc_Hoguin?=)
Date: Thu, 15 Aug 2013 16:19:42 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] [ANN] erlang.mk build tool
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

Hello friendly people,

I would like to make an official announcement of erlang.mk now that all 
the features I wanted are in.

erlang.mk is a rebar replacement. It was initially created for allowing 
a faster development process than rebar and for better compatibility 
with Linux build tools. It should work on Linux and OSX with GNU Make 
installed.

Projects using erlang.mk are still compatible with rebar. Dependencies 
fetched by rebar are stored in the same deps/ directory, and projects 
using erlang.mk can still be used as rebar dependencies, with or without 
a rebar.config file.

erlang.mk also features a simple package index. Try `make pkg-list` to 
list all packages currently available. All the packages listed are 
compatible with erlang.mk with no tweaking required.

Makefiles written with erlang.mk are *VERY* simple, here are two examples:

  *  https://github.com/extend/farwest/blob/master/Makefile
  *  https://github.com/extend/cowboy/blob/master/Makefile

I wrote about erlang.mk and relx recently on the Nine Nines blog. 
erlang.mk is the perfect companion to relx.

  *  http://ninenines.eu/articles/erlang.mk-and-relx

Here are examples of projects that are using and compatible with erlang.mk:

  *  https://github.com/jlouis/etorrent
  *  https://github.com/extend/cowboy
  *  https://github.com/extend/farwest

You can find erlang.mk at the following URL:

  *  https://github.com/extend/erlang.mk

Contributions to the package index are of course welcome! The only 
requirement is that the package is to be compatible with erlang.mk 
itself. Just send a PR to the erlang.mk project updating the 
packages.v1.txt!

Enjoy!

-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From desired.mta at gmail.com  Thu Aug 15 17:07:42 2013
From: desired.mta at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Motiejus_Jak=C5=A1tys?=)
Date: Thu, 15 Aug 2013 17:07:42 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] [erlang-questions] [ANN] erlang.mk build tool
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <CAFVMu-qtqDgB+-W6KXY1iYudeU-KsbF-OkNEEDTX8Hac+5MxoQ@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Aug 15, 2013 at 4:19 PM, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:
> Hello friendly people,
>
> I would like to make an official announcement of erlang.mk now that all the
> features I wanted are in.

Please include an ability to cleanly override any target so make does
not emit warnings about overwritten target. There are a few ways to do
it, but I find this the easiest: prefix every target in erlang.mk with
a variable:

$(.erlang-mk-all)all:
  <your stuff>

That way, if $(.erlang-mk-all) is defined (from my application
Makefile before including erlang.mk), your 'all' target will be the
one that does not cause me warnings.

Motiejus Jak?tys


From essen at ninenines.eu  Thu Aug 15 18:32:04 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?UTF-8?B?TG/Dr2MgSG9ndWlu?=)
Date: Thu, 15 Aug 2013 18:32:04 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] [erlang-questions] [ANN] erlang.mk build tool
In-Reply-To: <CAFVMu-qtqDgB+-W6KXY1iYudeU-KsbF-OkNEEDTX8Hac+5MxoQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <[email protected]>
 <CAFVMu-qtqDgB+-W6KXY1iYudeU-KsbF-OkNEEDTX8Hac+5MxoQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

On 08/15/2013 05:07 PM, Motiejus Jak?tys wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 15, 2013 at 4:19 PM, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:
>> Hello friendly people,
>>
>> I would like to make an official announcement of erlang.mk now that all the
>> features I wanted are in.
>
> Please include an ability to cleanly override any target so make does
> not emit warnings about overwritten target. There are a few ways to do
> it, but I find this the easiest: prefix every target in erlang.mk with
> a variable:
>
> $(.erlang-mk-all)all:
>    <your stuff>
>
> That way, if $(.erlang-mk-all) is defined (from my application
> Makefile before including erlang.mk), your 'all' target will be the
> one that does not cause me warnings.

Yes I was thinking about this, but so far nobody needed it. If you do, 
though, patches welcome!

-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From essen at ninenines.eu  Fri Aug 16 16:34:56 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lo=EFc_Hoguin?=)
Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2013 16:34:56 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] [erlang-questions] [ANN] erlang.mk build tool
In-Reply-To: <CAJNb-9qrsb=pdXziwNiOa5EF12e3QieMyj0N6OdzGY=-0CCz=A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <[email protected]>
 <CAJNb-9qrsb=pdXziwNiOa5EF12e3QieMyj0N6OdzGY=-0CCz=A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

On 08/16/2013 10:39 AM, Benoit Chesneau wrote:
> The big problem with erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> is requiring to have
> gmake and more importantly wget installed imo.

wget is only used for fetching the package index file. I'm sure if it 
doesn't work somewhere it'll be patched eventually.

> Which makes it quite annoying to distribute on systems that have none of
> them. It would be interrestin to have the support for curl for example.
> Also what are the makefile extensions that you really need to require gmake?

No idea. Patches are welcome for compatibility with different OS/build 
tools (as long as it's not "rewrite the whole file" of course, then 
you're better off just using gmake).

> - benoit
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 15, 2013 at 4:19 PM, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu
> <mailto:essen at ninenines.eu>> wrote:
>
>     Hello friendly people,
>
>     I would like to make an official announcement of erlang.mk
>     <http://erlang.mk> now that all the features I wanted are in.
>
>     erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> is a rebar replacement. It was
>     initially created for allowing a faster development process than
>     rebar and for better compatibility with Linux build tools. It should
>     work on Linux and OSX with GNU Make installed.
>
>     Projects using erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> are still compatible
>     with rebar. Dependencies fetched by rebar are stored in the same
>     deps/ directory, and projects using erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> can
>     still be used as rebar dependencies, with or without a rebar.config
>     file.
>
>     erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> also features a simple package index.
>     Try `make pkg-list` to list all packages currently available. All
>     the packages listed are compatible with erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk>
>     with no tweaking required.
>
>     Makefiles written with erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> are *VERY*
>     simple, here are two examples:
>
>       * https://github.com/extend/__farwest/blob/master/Makefile
>     <https://github.com/extend/farwest/blob/master/Makefile>
>       * https://github.com/extend/__cowboy/blob/master/Makefile
>     <https://github.com/extend/cowboy/blob/master/Makefile>
>
>     I wrote about erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> and relx recently on the
>     Nine Nines blog. erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> is the perfect
>     companion to relx.
>
>       * http://ninenines.eu/articles/__erlang.mk-and-relx
>     <http://ninenines.eu/articles/erlang.mk-and-relx>
>
>     Here are examples of projects that are using and compatible with
>     erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk>:
>
>       * https://github.com/jlouis/__etorrent
>     <https://github.com/jlouis/etorrent>
>       * https://github.com/extend/__cowboy
>     <https://github.com/extend/cowboy>
>       * https://github.com/extend/__farwest
>     <https://github.com/extend/farwest>
>
>     You can find erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> at the following URL:
>
>       * https://github.com/extend/__erlang.mk
>     <https://github.com/extend/erlang.mk>
>
>     Contributions to the package index are of course welcome! The only
>     requirement is that the package is to be compatible with erlang.mk
>     <http://erlang.mk> itself. Just send a PR to the erlang.mk
>     <http://erlang.mk> project updating the packages.v1.txt!
>
>     Enjoy!
>
>     --
>     Lo?c Hoguin
>     Erlang Cowboy
>     Nine Nines
>     http://ninenines.eu
>     _________________________________________________
>     erlang-questions mailing list
>     erlang-questions at erlang.org <mailto:erlang-questions at erlang.org>
>     http://erlang.org/mailman/__listinfo/erlang-questions
>     <http://erlang.org/mailman/listinfo/erlang-questions>
>
>


-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From jesper.louis.andersen at erlang-solutions.com  Fri Aug 16 10:01:01 2013
From: jesper.louis.andersen at erlang-solutions.com (Jesper Louis Andersen)
Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2013 10:01:01 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] [erlang-questions] [ANN] erlang.mk build tool
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <CAGrdgiWNpD7GAgE-8xHamW9FQSvnp=1SxODXeHy8erK8+P5wVg@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Aug 15, 2013 at 4:19 PM, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:

> I would like to make an official announcement of erlang.mk now that all
> the features I wanted are in.
>

I have been using erlang.mk for a while now, and recently I converted
etorrent to use it as a test of the viability in larger projects. Typical
gotchas:

* Projects has no Makefile. erlang.mk needs one. So add one!
* No `modules` section in the .app file. erlang.mk needs one to replace it.
Not adding this makes relx behave badly.
* If you use relx, it is more strict in what it accepts.
* Relx can't yet overlay sys.config :/

Apart from that, erlang.mk is a bliss to work with. In one project I am
working with:

Core i5 2.4Ghz approx 2010 Macbook Pro, encrypted disk (this hurts
performance like mad):

Cold build:

Rebar: 40 secs
elrang.mk: 42 secs

Build where each file is compiled in advance:

Rebar: 20 secs
erlang.mk: 0.4 secs

For my development cycle, this is important enough to spend time rewriting
projects to use erlang.mk. Also note that rebar.config and erlang.mk can
co-exist, so you don't need to abandon rebar for erlang.mk, which is
important.
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From bchesneau at gmail.com  Fri Aug 16 10:39:27 2013
From: bchesneau at gmail.com (Benoit Chesneau)
Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2013 10:39:27 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] [erlang-questions] [ANN] erlang.mk build tool
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <CAJNb-9qrsb=pdXziwNiOa5EF12e3QieMyj0N6OdzGY=-0CCz=A@mail.gmail.com>

The big problem with erlang.mk is requiring to have gmake and more
importantly wget installed imo.

Which makes it quite annoying to distribute on systems that have none of
them. It would be interrestin to have the support for curl for example.
Also what are the makefile extensions that you really need to require gmake?

- benoit


On Thu, Aug 15, 2013 at 4:19 PM, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:

> Hello friendly people,
>
> I would like to make an official announcement of erlang.mk now that all
> the features I wanted are in.
>
> erlang.mk is a rebar replacement. It was initially created for allowing a
> faster development process than rebar and for better compatibility with
> Linux build tools. It should work on Linux and OSX with GNU Make installed.
>
> Projects using erlang.mk are still compatible with rebar. Dependencies
> fetched by rebar are stored in the same deps/ directory, and projects using
> erlang.mk can still be used as rebar dependencies, with or without a
> rebar.config file.
>
> erlang.mk also features a simple package index. Try `make pkg-list` to
> list all packages currently available. All the packages listed are
> compatible with erlang.mk with no tweaking required.
>
> Makefiles written with erlang.mk are *VERY* simple, here are two examples:
>
>  *  https://github.com/extend/**farwest/blob/master/Makefile<https://github.com/extend/farwest/blob/master/Makefile>
>  *  https://github.com/extend/**cowboy/blob/master/Makefile<https://github.com/extend/cowboy/blob/master/Makefile>
>
> I wrote about erlang.mk and relx recently on the Nine Nines blog.
> erlang.mk is the perfect companion to relx.
>
>  *  http://ninenines.eu/articles/**erlang.mk-and-relx<http://ninenines.eu/articles/erlang.mk-and-relx>
>
> Here are examples of projects that are using and compatible with erlang.mk
> :
>
>  *  https://github.com/jlouis/**etorrent<https://github.com/jlouis/etorrent>
>  *  https://github.com/extend/**cowboy <https://github.com/extend/cowboy>
>  *  https://github.com/extend/**farwest<https://github.com/extend/farwest>
>
> You can find erlang.mk at the following URL:
>
>  *  https://github.com/extend/**erlang.mk<https://github.com/extend/erlang.mk>
>
> Contributions to the package index are of course welcome! The only
> requirement is that the package is to be compatible with erlang.mkitself. Just send a PR to the
> erlang.mk project updating the packages.v1.txt!
>
> Enjoy!
>
> --
> Lo?c Hoguin
> Erlang Cowboy
> Nine Nines
> http://ninenines.eu
> ______________________________**_________________
> erlang-questions mailing list
> erlang-questions at erlang.org
> http://erlang.org/mailman/**listinfo/erlang-questions<http://erlang.org/mailman/listinfo/erlang-questions>
>
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From dronnikov at gmail.com  Fri Aug 16 13:25:20 2013
From: dronnikov at gmail.com (Vladimir Dronnikov)
Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2013 15:25:20 +0400
Subject: [99s-extend] [erlang-questions] [ANN] erlang.mk build tool
In-Reply-To: <CAJNb-9qrsb=pdXziwNiOa5EF12e3QieMyj0N6OdzGY=-0CCz=A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <[email protected]>
 <CAJNb-9qrsb=pdXziwNiOa5EF12e3QieMyj0N6OdzGY=-0CCz=A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAE9na_MBpyKA1K0wVTf_NA58UNkohOmGQRSx6cy+q8ds0kjtGQ@mail.gmail.com>

I believe
curl -L $(PKG_FILE_URL) >$(PKG_FILE)
is kinda drop-in replacement for
wget -O $(PKG_FILE) $(PKG_FILE_URL)
used in erlang.mk.

Should be tested


On Fri, Aug 16, 2013 at 12:39 PM, Benoit Chesneau <bchesneau at gmail.com>wrote:

> The big problem with erlang.mk is requiring to have gmake and more
> importantly wget installed imo.
>
> Which makes it quite annoying to distribute on systems that have none of
> them. It would be interrestin to have the support for curl for example.
> Also what are the makefile extensions that you really need to require gmake?
>
> - benoit
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 15, 2013 at 4:19 PM, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:
>
>> Hello friendly people,
>>
>> I would like to make an official announcement of erlang.mk now that all
>> the features I wanted are in.
>>
>> erlang.mk is a rebar replacement. It was initially created for allowing
>> a faster development process than rebar and for better compatibility with
>> Linux build tools. It should work on Linux and OSX with GNU Make installed.
>>
>> Projects using erlang.mk are still compatible with rebar. Dependencies
>> fetched by rebar are stored in the same deps/ directory, and projects using
>> erlang.mk can still be used as rebar dependencies, with or without a
>> rebar.config file.
>>
>> erlang.mk also features a simple package index. Try `make pkg-list` to
>> list all packages currently available. All the packages listed are
>> compatible with erlang.mk with no tweaking required.
>>
>> Makefiles written with erlang.mk are *VERY* simple, here are two
>> examples:
>>
>>  *  https://github.com/extend/**farwest/blob/master/Makefile<https://github.com/extend/farwest/blob/master/Makefile>
>>  *  https://github.com/extend/**cowboy/blob/master/Makefile<https://github.com/extend/cowboy/blob/master/Makefile>
>>
>> I wrote about erlang.mk and relx recently on the Nine Nines blog.
>> erlang.mk is the perfect companion to relx.
>>
>>  *  http://ninenines.eu/articles/**erlang.mk-and-relx<http://ninenines.eu/articles/erlang.mk-and-relx>
>>
>> Here are examples of projects that are using and compatible with
>> erlang.mk:
>>
>>  *  https://github.com/jlouis/**etorrent<https://github.com/jlouis/etorrent>
>>  *  https://github.com/extend/**cowboy <https://github.com/extend/cowboy>
>>  *  https://github.com/extend/**farwest<https://github.com/extend/farwest>
>>
>> You can find erlang.mk at the following URL:
>>
>>  *  https://github.com/extend/**erlang.mk<https://github.com/extend/erlang.mk>
>>
>> Contributions to the package index are of course welcome! The only
>> requirement is that the package is to be compatible with erlang.mkitself. Just send a PR to the
>> erlang.mk project updating the packages.v1.txt!
>>
>> Enjoy!
>>
>> --
>> Lo?c Hoguin
>> Erlang Cowboy
>> Nine Nines
>> http://ninenines.eu
>> ______________________________**_________________
>> erlang-questions mailing list
>> erlang-questions at erlang.org
>> http://erlang.org/mailman/**listinfo/erlang-questions<http://erlang.org/mailman/listinfo/erlang-questions>
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> erlang-questions mailing list
> erlang-questions at erlang.org
> http://erlang.org/mailman/listinfo/erlang-questions
>
>
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From steve at srstrong.com  Fri Aug 16 14:27:48 2013
From: steve at srstrong.com (Steve Strong)
Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2013 14:27:48 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] [erlang-questions] [ANN] erlang.mk build tool
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

Looks good - I like simple!  Quick question, does it support multiple applications, for example a project laid out as:  

/proj
/deps
/stuff

/apps
/app1
/app2

Most of our stuff is in that form, with shared dependencies between the various apps.  Rebar is quite happy with that format, but I can't see how to persuade erlang.mk to handle that.

Cheers,

Steve  

--  
Steve Strong
Sent with Sparrow (http://www.sparrowmailapp.com/?sig)


On Thursday, 15 August 2013 at 16:19, Lo?c Hoguin wrote:

> Hello friendly people,
>  
> I would like to make an official announcement of erlang.mk now that all  
> the features I wanted are in.
>  
> erlang.mk is a rebar replacement. It was initially created for allowing  
> a faster development process than rebar and for better compatibility  
> with Linux build tools. It should work on Linux and OSX with GNU Make  
> installed.
>  
> Projects using erlang.mk are still compatible with rebar. Dependencies  
> fetched by rebar are stored in the same deps/ directory, and projects  
> using erlang.mk can still be used as rebar dependencies, with or without  
> a rebar.config file.
>  
> erlang.mk also features a simple package index. Try `make pkg-list` to  
> list all packages currently available. All the packages listed are  
> compatible with erlang.mk with no tweaking required.
>  
> Makefiles written with erlang.mk are *VERY* simple, here are two examples:
>  
> * https://github.com/extend/farwest/blob/master/Makefile
> * https://github.com/extend/cowboy/blob/master/Makefile
>  
> I wrote about erlang.mk and relx recently on the Nine Nines blog.  
> erlang.mk is the perfect companion to relx.
>  
> * http://ninenines.eu/articles/erlang.mk-and-relx
>  
> Here are examples of projects that are using and compatible with erlang.mk:
>  
> * https://github.com/jlouis/etorrent
> * https://github.com/extend/cowboy
> * https://github.com/extend/farwest
>  
> You can find erlang.mk at the following URL:
>  
> * https://github.com/extend/erlang.mk
>  
> Contributions to the package index are of course welcome! The only  
> requirement is that the package is to be compatible with erlang.mk  
> itself. Just send a PR to the erlang.mk project updating the  
> packages.v1.txt!
>  
> Enjoy!
>  
> --  
> Lo?c Hoguin
> Erlang Cowboy
> Nine Nines
> http://ninenines.eu
> _______________________________________________
> erlang-questions mailing list
> erlang-questions at erlang.org (mailto:erlang-questions at erlang.org)
> http://erlang.org/mailman/listinfo/erlang-questions
>  
>  


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From list1 at gjunka.com  Fri Aug 16 16:42:28 2013
From: list1 at gjunka.com (Grzegorz Junka)
Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2013 15:42:28 +0100
Subject: [99s-extend] [erlang-questions] [ANN] erlang.mk build tool
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>
 <CAJNb-9qrsb=pdXziwNiOa5EF12e3QieMyj0N6OdzGY=-0CCz=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

Why not use Erlang for downloading? Surely if erlang.mk is a tool for 
Erlang then it will be very likely installed. For example this target 
downloads Rebar:

# Erlang Rebar downloading, see:
# 
https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!topic/erlang-programming/U0JJ3SeUv5Y
rb_rebar_url=http://cloud.github.com/downloads/basho/rebar/rebar
./rebar:
$(ERL) -noshell -s inets -s ssl \
-eval 'httpc:request(get, {"$(rb_rebar_url)", []}, [], [{stream, 
"./rebar"}])' \
-s init stop
chmod +x ./rebar
REBAR=$(shell (type rebar 2>/dev/null || echo ./rebar) | tail -1 | awk 
'{ print $$NF }')


It could be used to download anything, not just REBAR.

- Greg


On 16/08/2013 15:34, Lo?c Hoguin wrote:
> On 08/16/2013 10:39 AM, Benoit Chesneau wrote:
>> The big problem with erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> is requiring to have
>> gmake and more importantly wget installed imo.
>
> wget is only used for fetching the package index file. I'm sure if it 
> doesn't work somewhere it'll be patched eventually.
>
>> Which makes it quite annoying to distribute on systems that have none of
>> them. It would be interrestin to have the support for curl for example.
>> Also what are the makefile extensions that you really need to require 
>> gmake?
>
> No idea. Patches are welcome for compatibility with different OS/build 
> tools (as long as it's not "rewrite the whole file" of course, then 
> you're better off just using gmake).
>
>> - benoit
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Aug 15, 2013 at 4:19 PM, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu
>> <mailto:essen at ninenines.eu>> wrote:
>>
>>     Hello friendly people,
>>
>>     I would like to make an official announcement of erlang.mk
>>     <http://erlang.mk> now that all the features I wanted are in.
>>
>>     erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> is a rebar replacement. It was
>>     initially created for allowing a faster development process than
>>     rebar and for better compatibility with Linux build tools. It should
>>     work on Linux and OSX with GNU Make installed.
>>
>>     Projects using erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> are still compatible
>>     with rebar. Dependencies fetched by rebar are stored in the same
>>     deps/ directory, and projects using erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> can
>>     still be used as rebar dependencies, with or without a rebar.config
>>     file.
>>
>>     erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> also features a simple package index.
>>     Try `make pkg-list` to list all packages currently available. All
>>     the packages listed are compatible with erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk>
>>     with no tweaking required.
>>
>>     Makefiles written with erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> are *VERY*
>>     simple, here are two examples:
>>
>>       * https://github.com/extend/__farwest/blob/master/Makefile
>> <https://github.com/extend/farwest/blob/master/Makefile>
>>       * https://github.com/extend/__cowboy/blob/master/Makefile
>> <https://github.com/extend/cowboy/blob/master/Makefile>
>>
>>     I wrote about erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> and relx recently on the
>>     Nine Nines blog. erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> is the perfect
>>     companion to relx.
>>
>>       * http://ninenines.eu/articles/__erlang.mk-and-relx
>>     <http://ninenines.eu/articles/erlang.mk-and-relx>
>>
>>     Here are examples of projects that are using and compatible with
>>     erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk>:
>>
>>       * https://github.com/jlouis/__etorrent
>>     <https://github.com/jlouis/etorrent>
>>       * https://github.com/extend/__cowboy
>>     <https://github.com/extend/cowboy>
>>       * https://github.com/extend/__farwest
>>     <https://github.com/extend/farwest>
>>
>>     You can find erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> at the following URL:
>>
>>       * https://github.com/extend/__erlang.mk
>>     <https://github.com/extend/erlang.mk>
>>
>>     Contributions to the package index are of course welcome! The only
>>     requirement is that the package is to be compatible with erlang.mk
>>     <http://erlang.mk> itself. Just send a PR to the erlang.mk
>>     <http://erlang.mk> project updating the packages.v1.txt!
>>
>>     Enjoy!
>>
>>     --
>>     Lo?c Hoguin
>>     Erlang Cowboy
>>     Nine Nines
>>     http://ninenines.eu
>>     _________________________________________________
>>     erlang-questions mailing list
>>     erlang-questions at erlang.org <mailto:erlang-questions at erlang.org>
>>     http://erlang.org/mailman/__listinfo/erlang-questions
>>     <http://erlang.org/mailman/listinfo/erlang-questions>
>>
>>
>
>

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From essen at ninenines.eu  Fri Aug 16 16:42:39 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?UTF-8?B?TG/Dr2MgSG9ndWlu?=)
Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2013 16:42:39 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] [erlang-questions] [ANN] erlang.mk build tool
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

Well I'm sure if you create a base Makefile (without erlang.mk) that 
exports DEPS_DIR and then call $(MAKE) on all folders in /apps (which 
would themselves contain Makefiles that use erlang.mk), it would work 
just fine. You can still keep only one erlang.mk in your repos and use 
include ../../erlang.mk instead for example.

But know that this folder structure is a rebar thing and not standard 
(just like /deps you'll say, but that one is insanely useful regardless 
of the project structure otherwise).

On 08/16/2013 02:27 PM, Steve Strong wrote:
> Looks good - I like simple!  Quick question, does it support multiple
> applications, for example a project laid out as:
>
> /proj
> /deps
> /stuff
>
> /apps
> /app1
> /app2
>
> Most of our stuff is in that form, with shared dependencies between the
> various apps.  Rebar is quite happy with that format, but I can't see
> how to persuade erlang.mk to handle that.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Steve
>
> --
> Steve Strong
> Sent with Sparrow <http://www.sparrowmailapp.com/?sig>
>
> On Thursday, 15 August 2013 at 16:19, Lo?c Hoguin wrote:
>
>> Hello friendly people,
>>
>> I would like to make an official announcement of erlang.mk now that all
>> the features I wanted are in.
>>
>> erlang.mk is a rebar replacement. It was initially created for allowing
>> a faster development process than rebar and for better compatibility
>> with Linux build tools. It should work on Linux and OSX with GNU Make
>> installed.
>>
>> Projects using erlang.mk are still compatible with rebar. Dependencies
>> fetched by rebar are stored in the same deps/ directory, and projects
>> using erlang.mk can still be used as rebar dependencies, with or without
>> a rebar.config file.
>>
>> erlang.mk also features a simple package index. Try `make pkg-list` to
>> list all packages currently available. All the packages listed are
>> compatible with erlang.mk with no tweaking required.
>>
>> Makefiles written with erlang.mk are *VERY* simple, here are two examples:
>>
>> * https://github.com/extend/farwest/blob/master/Makefile
>> * https://github.com/extend/cowboy/blob/master/Makefile
>>
>> I wrote about erlang.mk and relx recently on the Nine Nines blog.
>> erlang.mk is the perfect companion to relx.
>>
>> * http://ninenines.eu/articles/erlang.mk-and-relx
>>
>> Here are examples of projects that are using and compatible with
>> erlang.mk:
>>
>> * https://github.com/jlouis/etorrent
>> * https://github.com/extend/cowboy
>> * https://github.com/extend/farwest
>>
>> You can find erlang.mk at the following URL:
>>
>> * https://github.com/extend/erlang.mk
>>
>> Contributions to the package index are of course welcome! The only
>> requirement is that the package is to be compatible with erlang.mk
>> itself. Just send a PR to the erlang.mk project updating the
>> packages.v1.txt!
>>
>> Enjoy!
>>
>> --
>> Lo?c Hoguin
>> Erlang Cowboy
>> Nine Nines
>> http://ninenines.eu
>> _______________________________________________
>> erlang-questions mailing list
>> erlang-questions at erlang.org <mailto:erlang-questions at erlang.org>
>> http://erlang.org/mailman/listinfo/erlang-questions
>


-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From essen at ninenines.eu  Fri Aug 16 16:44:58 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lo=EFc_Hoguin?=)
Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2013 16:44:58 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] [erlang-questions] [ANN] erlang.mk build tool
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>
 <CAJNb-9qrsb=pdXziwNiOa5EF12e3QieMyj0N6OdzGY=-0CCz=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

Starting Erlang takes too long. That's a big reason why erlang.mk was 
created. :)

I recall NetBSD being able to download things with a shell script only 
(as it comes with nothing installed), this would be a more interesting 
solution especially since we can bundle it in the erlang.mk file too.

On 08/16/2013 04:42 PM, Grzegorz Junka wrote:
> Why not use Erlang for downloading? Surely if erlang.mk is a tool for
> Erlang then it will be very likely installed. For example this target
> downloads Rebar:
>
> # Erlang Rebar downloading, see:
> #
> https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!topic/erlang-programming/U0JJ3SeUv5Y
> rb_rebar_url=http://cloud.github.com/downloads/basho/rebar/rebar
> ./rebar:
> $(ERL) -noshell -s inets -s ssl \
> -eval 'httpc:request(get, {"$(rb_rebar_url)", []}, [], [{stream,
> "./rebar"}])' \
> -s init stop
> chmod +x ./rebar
> REBAR=$(shell (type rebar 2>/dev/null || echo ./rebar) | tail -1 | awk
> '{ print $$NF }')
>
>
> It could be used to download anything, not just REBAR.
>
> - Greg
>
>
> On 16/08/2013 15:34, Lo?c Hoguin wrote:
>> On 08/16/2013 10:39 AM, Benoit Chesneau wrote:
>>> The big problem with erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> is requiring to have
>>> gmake and more importantly wget installed imo.
>>
>> wget is only used for fetching the package index file. I'm sure if it
>> doesn't work somewhere it'll be patched eventually.
>>
>>> Which makes it quite annoying to distribute on systems that have none of
>>> them. It would be interrestin to have the support for curl for example.
>>> Also what are the makefile extensions that you really need to require
>>> gmake?
>>
>> No idea. Patches are welcome for compatibility with different OS/build
>> tools (as long as it's not "rewrite the whole file" of course, then
>> you're better off just using gmake).
>>
>>> - benoit
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Aug 15, 2013 at 4:19 PM, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu
>>> <mailto:essen at ninenines.eu>> wrote:
>>>
>>>     Hello friendly people,
>>>
>>>     I would like to make an official announcement of erlang.mk
>>> <http://erlang.mk> now that all the features I wanted are in.
>>>
>>>     erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> is a rebar replacement. It was
>>>     initially created for allowing a faster development process than
>>>     rebar and for better compatibility with Linux build tools. It should
>>>     work on Linux and OSX with GNU Make installed.
>>>
>>>     Projects using erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> are still compatible
>>>     with rebar. Dependencies fetched by rebar are stored in the same
>>>     deps/ directory, and projects using erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> can
>>>     still be used as rebar dependencies, with or without a rebar.config
>>>     file.
>>>
>>>     erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> also features a simple package index.
>>>     Try `make pkg-list` to list all packages currently available. All
>>>     the packages listed are compatible with erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk>
>>>     with no tweaking required.
>>>
>>>     Makefiles written with erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> are *VERY*
>>>     simple, here are two examples:
>>>
>>>       * https://github.com/extend/__farwest/blob/master/Makefile
>>> <https://github.com/extend/farwest/blob/master/Makefile>
>>>       * https://github.com/extend/__cowboy/blob/master/Makefile
>>> <https://github.com/extend/cowboy/blob/master/Makefile>
>>>
>>>     I wrote about erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> and relx recently on the
>>>     Nine Nines blog. erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> is the perfect
>>>     companion to relx.
>>>
>>>       * http://ninenines.eu/articles/__erlang.mk-and-relx
>>> <http://ninenines.eu/articles/erlang.mk-and-relx>
>>>
>>>     Here are examples of projects that are using and compatible with
>>>     erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk>:
>>>
>>>       * https://github.com/jlouis/__etorrent
>>> <https://github.com/jlouis/etorrent>
>>>       * https://github.com/extend/__cowboy
>>> <https://github.com/extend/cowboy>
>>>       * https://github.com/extend/__farwest
>>> <https://github.com/extend/farwest>
>>>
>>>     You can find erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> at the following URL:
>>>
>>>       * https://github.com/extend/__erlang.mk
>>> <https://github.com/extend/erlang.mk>
>>>
>>>     Contributions to the package index are of course welcome! The only
>>>     requirement is that the package is to be compatible with erlang.mk
>>> <http://erlang.mk> itself. Just send a PR to the erlang.mk
>>> <http://erlang.mk> project updating the packages.v1.txt!
>>>
>>>     Enjoy!
>>>
>>>     --
>>>     Lo?c Hoguin
>>>     Erlang Cowboy
>>>     Nine Nines
>>> http://ninenines.eu
>>>     _________________________________________________
>>>     erlang-questions mailing list
>>> erlang-questions at erlang.org <mailto:erlang-questions at erlang.org>
>>> http://erlang.org/mailman/__listinfo/erlang-questions
>>> <http://erlang.org/mailman/listinfo/erlang-questions>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Extend mailing list
> Extend at lists.ninenines.eu
> http://lists.ninenines.eu:81/listinfo/extend
>


-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From steve at srstrong.com  Fri Aug 16 16:44:07 2013
From: steve at srstrong.com (Steve Strong)
Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2013 16:44:07 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] [erlang-questions] [ANN] erlang.mk build tool
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

Was guessing that was the answer - I'll give it a go...  

--  
Steve Strong
Sent with Sparrow (http://www.sparrowmailapp.com/?sig)


On Friday, 16 August 2013 at 16:42, Lo?c Hoguin wrote:

> Well I'm sure if you create a base Makefile (without erlang.mk) that  
> exports DEPS_DIR and then call $(MAKE) on all folders in /apps (which  
> would themselves contain Makefiles that use erlang.mk), it would work  
> just fine. You can still keep only one erlang.mk in your repos and use  
> include ../../erlang.mk instead for example.
>  
> But know that this folder structure is a rebar thing and not standard  
> (just like /deps you'll say, but that one is insanely useful regardless  
> of the project structure otherwise).
>  
> On 08/16/2013 02:27 PM, Steve Strong wrote:
> > Looks good - I like simple! Quick question, does it support multiple
> > applications, for example a project laid out as:
> >  
> > /proj
> > /deps
> > /stuff
> >  
> > /apps
> > /app1
> > /app2
> >  
> > Most of our stuff is in that form, with shared dependencies between the
> > various apps. Rebar is quite happy with that format, but I can't see
> > how to persuade erlang.mk to handle that.
> >  
> > Cheers,
> >  
> > Steve
> >  
> > --
> > Steve Strong
> > Sent with Sparrow <http://www.sparrowmailapp.com/?sig>
> >  
> > On Thursday, 15 August 2013 at 16:19, Lo?c Hoguin wrote:
> >  
> > > Hello friendly people,
> > >  
> > > I would like to make an official announcement of erlang.mk now that all
> > > the features I wanted are in.
> > >  
> > > erlang.mk is a rebar replacement. It was initially created for allowing
> > > a faster development process than rebar and for better compatibility
> > > with Linux build tools. It should work on Linux and OSX with GNU Make
> > > installed.
> > >  
> > > Projects using erlang.mk are still compatible with rebar. Dependencies
> > > fetched by rebar are stored in the same deps/ directory, and projects
> > > using erlang.mk can still be used as rebar dependencies, with or without
> > > a rebar.config file.
> > >  
> > > erlang.mk also features a simple package index. Try `make pkg-list` to
> > > list all packages currently available. All the packages listed are
> > > compatible with erlang.mk with no tweaking required.
> > >  
> > > Makefiles written with erlang.mk are *VERY* simple, here are two examples:
> > >  
> > > * https://github.com/extend/farwest/blob/master/Makefile
> > > * https://github.com/extend/cowboy/blob/master/Makefile
> > >  
> > > I wrote about erlang.mk and relx recently on the Nine Nines blog.
> > > erlang.mk is the perfect companion to relx.
> > >  
> > > * http://ninenines.eu/articles/erlang.mk-and-relx
> > >  
> > > Here are examples of projects that are using and compatible with
> > > erlang.mk:
> > >  
> > > * https://github.com/jlouis/etorrent
> > > * https://github.com/extend/cowboy
> > > * https://github.com/extend/farwest
> > >  
> > > You can find erlang.mk at the following URL:
> > >  
> > > * https://github.com/extend/erlang.mk
> > >  
> > > Contributions to the package index are of course welcome! The only
> > > requirement is that the package is to be compatible with erlang.mk
> > > itself. Just send a PR to the erlang.mk project updating the
> > > packages.v1.txt!
> > >  
> > > Enjoy!
> > >  
> > > --
> > > Lo?c Hoguin
> > > Erlang Cowboy
> > > Nine Nines
> > > http://ninenines.eu
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > erlang-questions mailing list
> > > erlang-questions at erlang.org <mailto:erlang-questions at erlang.org>
> > > http://erlang.org/mailman/listinfo/erlang-questions
> > >  
> >  
> >  
>  
>  
>  
> --  
> Lo?c Hoguin
> Erlang Cowboy
> Nine Nines
> http://ninenines.eu
>  
>  


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From list1 at gjunka.com  Fri Aug 16 17:02:00 2013
From: list1 at gjunka.com (Grzegorz Junka)
Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2013 16:02:00 +0100
Subject: [99s-extend] [erlang-questions] [ANN] erlang.mk build tool
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>
 <CAJNb-9qrsb=pdXziwNiOa5EF12e3QieMyj0N6OdzGY=-0CCz=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

But it "is only used for fetching the package index file"... :) If the 
target is up to date there is no starting of Erlang. But on the other 
hand it could be used conditionally, e.g. use wget on systems on which 
it is installed and Erlang otherwise. It's just down to creating a 
properly structured target, isn't?

On 16/08/2013 15:44, Lo?c Hoguin wrote:
> Starting Erlang takes too long. That's a big reason why erlang.mk was 
> created. :)
>
> I recall NetBSD being able to download things with a shell script only 
> (as it comes with nothing installed), this would be a more interesting 
> solution especially since we can bundle it in the erlang.mk file too.
>
> On 08/16/2013 04:42 PM, Grzegorz Junka wrote:
>> Why not use Erlang for downloading? Surely if erlang.mk is a tool for
>> Erlang then it will be very likely installed. For example this target
>> downloads Rebar:
>>
>> # Erlang Rebar downloading, see:
>> #
>> https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!topic/erlang-programming/U0JJ3SeUv5Y 
>>
>> rb_rebar_url=http://cloud.github.com/downloads/basho/rebar/rebar
>> ./rebar:
>> $(ERL) -noshell -s inets -s ssl \
>> -eval 'httpc:request(get, {"$(rb_rebar_url)", []}, [], [{stream,
>> "./rebar"}])' \
>> -s init stop
>> chmod +x ./rebar
>> REBAR=$(shell (type rebar 2>/dev/null || echo ./rebar) | tail -1 | awk
>> '{ print $$NF }')
>>
>>
>> It could be used to download anything, not just REBAR.
>>
>> - Greg
>>
>>
>> On 16/08/2013 15:34, Lo?c Hoguin wrote:
>>> On 08/16/2013 10:39 AM, Benoit Chesneau wrote:
>>>> The big problem with erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> is requiring to have
>>>> gmake and more importantly wget installed imo.
>>>
>>> wget is only used for fetching the package index file. I'm sure if it
>>> doesn't work somewhere it'll be patched eventually.
>>>
>>>> Which makes it quite annoying to distribute on systems that have 
>>>> none of
>>>> them. It would be interrestin to have the support for curl for 
>>>> example.
>>>> Also what are the makefile extensions that you really need to require
>>>> gmake?
>>>
>>> No idea. Patches are welcome for compatibility with different OS/build
>>> tools (as long as it's not "rewrite the whole file" of course, then
>>> you're better off just using gmake).
>>>
>>>> - benoit
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Aug 15, 2013 at 4:19 PM, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu
>>>> <mailto:essen at ninenines.eu>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>     Hello friendly people,
>>>>
>>>>     I would like to make an official announcement of erlang.mk
>>>> <http://erlang.mk> now that all the features I wanted are in.
>>>>
>>>>     erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> is a rebar replacement. It was
>>>>     initially created for allowing a faster development process than
>>>>     rebar and for better compatibility with Linux build tools. It 
>>>> should
>>>>     work on Linux and OSX with GNU Make installed.
>>>>
>>>>     Projects using erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> are still compatible
>>>>     with rebar. Dependencies fetched by rebar are stored in the same
>>>>     deps/ directory, and projects using erlang.mk 
>>>> <http://erlang.mk> can
>>>>     still be used as rebar dependencies, with or without a 
>>>> rebar.config
>>>>     file.
>>>>
>>>>     erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> also features a simple package index.
>>>>     Try `make pkg-list` to list all packages currently available. All
>>>>     the packages listed are compatible with erlang.mk 
>>>> <http://erlang.mk>
>>>>     with no tweaking required.
>>>>
>>>>     Makefiles written with erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> are *VERY*
>>>>     simple, here are two examples:
>>>>
>>>>       * https://github.com/extend/__farwest/blob/master/Makefile
>>>> <https://github.com/extend/farwest/blob/master/Makefile>
>>>>       * https://github.com/extend/__cowboy/blob/master/Makefile
>>>> <https://github.com/extend/cowboy/blob/master/Makefile>
>>>>
>>>>     I wrote about erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> and relx recently on 
>>>> the
>>>>     Nine Nines blog. erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> is the perfect
>>>>     companion to relx.
>>>>
>>>>       * http://ninenines.eu/articles/__erlang.mk-and-relx
>>>> <http://ninenines.eu/articles/erlang.mk-and-relx>
>>>>
>>>>     Here are examples of projects that are using and compatible with
>>>>     erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk>:
>>>>
>>>>       * https://github.com/jlouis/__etorrent
>>>> <https://github.com/jlouis/etorrent>
>>>>       * https://github.com/extend/__cowboy
>>>> <https://github.com/extend/cowboy>
>>>>       * https://github.com/extend/__farwest
>>>> <https://github.com/extend/farwest>
>>>>
>>>>     You can find erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> at the following URL:
>>>>
>>>>       * https://github.com/extend/__erlang.mk
>>>> <https://github.com/extend/erlang.mk>
>>>>
>>>>     Contributions to the package index are of course welcome! The only
>>>>     requirement is that the package is to be compatible with erlang.mk
>>>> <http://erlang.mk> itself. Just send a PR to the erlang.mk
>>>> <http://erlang.mk> project updating the packages.v1.txt!
>>>>
>>>>     Enjoy!
>>>>
>>>>     --
>>>>     Lo?c Hoguin
>>>>     Erlang Cowboy
>>>>     Nine Nines
>>>> http://ninenines.eu
>>>>     _________________________________________________
>>>>     erlang-questions mailing list
>>>> erlang-questions at erlang.org <mailto:erlang-questions at erlang.org>
>>>> http://erlang.org/mailman/__listinfo/erlang-questions
>>>> <http://erlang.org/mailman/listinfo/erlang-questions>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Extend mailing list
>> Extend at lists.ninenines.eu
>> http://lists.ninenines.eu:81/listinfo/extend
>>
>
>



From essen at ninenines.eu  Fri Aug 16 17:10:19 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lo=EFc_Hoguin?=)
Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2013 17:10:19 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] [erlang-questions] [ANN] erlang.mk build tool
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>
 <CAJNb-9qrsb=pdXziwNiOa5EF12e3QieMyj0N6OdzGY=-0CCz=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

I know, and if it makes it work where it currently doesn't I'd merge it. 
But ultimately we want to avoid starting Erlang unless strictly necessary.

On 08/16/2013 05:02 PM, Grzegorz Junka wrote:
> But it "is only used for fetching the package index file"... :) If the
> target is up to date there is no starting of Erlang. But on the other
> hand it could be used conditionally, e.g. use wget on systems on which
> it is installed and Erlang otherwise. It's just down to creating a
> properly structured target, isn't?
>
> On 16/08/2013 15:44, Lo?c Hoguin wrote:
>> Starting Erlang takes too long. That's a big reason why erlang.mk was
>> created. :)
>>
>> I recall NetBSD being able to download things with a shell script only
>> (as it comes with nothing installed), this would be a more interesting
>> solution especially since we can bundle it in the erlang.mk file too.
>>
>> On 08/16/2013 04:42 PM, Grzegorz Junka wrote:
>>> Why not use Erlang for downloading? Surely if erlang.mk is a tool for
>>> Erlang then it will be very likely installed. For example this target
>>> downloads Rebar:
>>>
>>> # Erlang Rebar downloading, see:
>>> #
>>> https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!topic/erlang-programming/U0JJ3SeUv5Y
>>>
>>> rb_rebar_url=http://cloud.github.com/downloads/basho/rebar/rebar
>>> ./rebar:
>>> $(ERL) -noshell -s inets -s ssl \
>>> -eval 'httpc:request(get, {"$(rb_rebar_url)", []}, [], [{stream,
>>> "./rebar"}])' \
>>> -s init stop
>>> chmod +x ./rebar
>>> REBAR=$(shell (type rebar 2>/dev/null || echo ./rebar) | tail -1 | awk
>>> '{ print $$NF }')
>>>
>>>
>>> It could be used to download anything, not just REBAR.
>>>
>>> - Greg
>>>
>>>
>>> On 16/08/2013 15:34, Lo?c Hoguin wrote:
>>>> On 08/16/2013 10:39 AM, Benoit Chesneau wrote:
>>>>> The big problem with erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> is requiring to have
>>>>> gmake and more importantly wget installed imo.
>>>>
>>>> wget is only used for fetching the package index file. I'm sure if it
>>>> doesn't work somewhere it'll be patched eventually.
>>>>
>>>>> Which makes it quite annoying to distribute on systems that have
>>>>> none of
>>>>> them. It would be interrestin to have the support for curl for
>>>>> example.
>>>>> Also what are the makefile extensions that you really need to require
>>>>> gmake?
>>>>
>>>> No idea. Patches are welcome for compatibility with different OS/build
>>>> tools (as long as it's not "rewrite the whole file" of course, then
>>>> you're better off just using gmake).
>>>>
>>>>> - benoit
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Aug 15, 2013 at 4:19 PM, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu
>>>>> <mailto:essen at ninenines.eu>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>     Hello friendly people,
>>>>>
>>>>>     I would like to make an official announcement of erlang.mk
>>>>> <http://erlang.mk> now that all the features I wanted are in.
>>>>>
>>>>>     erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> is a rebar replacement. It was
>>>>>     initially created for allowing a faster development process than
>>>>>     rebar and for better compatibility with Linux build tools. It
>>>>> should
>>>>>     work on Linux and OSX with GNU Make installed.
>>>>>
>>>>>     Projects using erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> are still compatible
>>>>>     with rebar. Dependencies fetched by rebar are stored in the same
>>>>>     deps/ directory, and projects using erlang.mk
>>>>> <http://erlang.mk> can
>>>>>     still be used as rebar dependencies, with or without a
>>>>> rebar.config
>>>>>     file.
>>>>>
>>>>>     erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> also features a simple package index.
>>>>>     Try `make pkg-list` to list all packages currently available. All
>>>>>     the packages listed are compatible with erlang.mk
>>>>> <http://erlang.mk>
>>>>>     with no tweaking required.
>>>>>
>>>>>     Makefiles written with erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> are *VERY*
>>>>>     simple, here are two examples:
>>>>>
>>>>>       * https://github.com/extend/__farwest/blob/master/Makefile
>>>>> <https://github.com/extend/farwest/blob/master/Makefile>
>>>>>       * https://github.com/extend/__cowboy/blob/master/Makefile
>>>>> <https://github.com/extend/cowboy/blob/master/Makefile>
>>>>>
>>>>>     I wrote about erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> and relx recently on
>>>>> the
>>>>>     Nine Nines blog. erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> is the perfect
>>>>>     companion to relx.
>>>>>
>>>>>       * http://ninenines.eu/articles/__erlang.mk-and-relx
>>>>> <http://ninenines.eu/articles/erlang.mk-and-relx>
>>>>>
>>>>>     Here are examples of projects that are using and compatible with
>>>>>     erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk>:
>>>>>
>>>>>       * https://github.com/jlouis/__etorrent
>>>>> <https://github.com/jlouis/etorrent>
>>>>>       * https://github.com/extend/__cowboy
>>>>> <https://github.com/extend/cowboy>
>>>>>       * https://github.com/extend/__farwest
>>>>> <https://github.com/extend/farwest>
>>>>>
>>>>>     You can find erlang.mk <http://erlang.mk> at the following URL:
>>>>>
>>>>>       * https://github.com/extend/__erlang.mk
>>>>> <https://github.com/extend/erlang.mk>
>>>>>
>>>>>     Contributions to the package index are of course welcome! The only
>>>>>     requirement is that the package is to be compatible with erlang.mk
>>>>> <http://erlang.mk> itself. Just send a PR to the erlang.mk
>>>>> <http://erlang.mk> project updating the packages.v1.txt!
>>>>>
>>>>>     Enjoy!
>>>>>
>>>>>     --
>>>>>     Lo?c Hoguin
>>>>>     Erlang Cowboy
>>>>>     Nine Nines
>>>>> http://ninenines.eu
>>>>>     _________________________________________________
>>>>>     erlang-questions mailing list
>>>>> erlang-questions at erlang.org <mailto:erlang-questions at erlang.org>
>>>>> http://erlang.org/mailman/__listinfo/erlang-questions
>>>>> <http://erlang.org/mailman/listinfo/erlang-questions>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Extend mailing list
>>> Extend at lists.ninenines.eu
>>> http://lists.ninenines.eu:81/listinfo/extend
>>>
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Extend mailing list
> Extend at lists.ninenines.eu
> http://lists.ninenines.eu:81/listinfo/extend


-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From wbin00 at gmail.com  Fri Aug 16 17:40:22 2013
From: wbin00 at gmail.com (Bin Wang)
Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2013 23:40:22 +0800
Subject: [99s-extend] [erlang-questions] [ANN] erlang.mk build tool
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>
 <CAJNb-9qrsb=pdXziwNiOa5EF12e3QieMyj0N6OdzGY=-0CCz=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <CAD_32VXteDmb218jRdJcabGSrc7zUvuTpxov+Os=D07Ce5pSZQ@mail.gmail.com>

Will it support protobuf(https://github.com/basho/erlang_protobuffs),
I cannot compile *.proto file from src/ with erlang.mk.


From essen at ninenines.eu  Fri Aug 16 17:55:30 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lo=EFc_Hoguin?=)
Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2013 17:55:30 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] [erlang-questions] [ANN] erlang.mk build tool
In-Reply-To: <CAD_32VXteDmb218jRdJcabGSrc7zUvuTpxov+Os=D07Ce5pSZQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <[email protected]>
 <CAJNb-9qrsb=pdXziwNiOa5EF12e3QieMyj0N6OdzGY=-0CCz=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAD_32VXteDmb218jRdJcabGSrc7zUvuTpxov+Os=D07Ce5pSZQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

On 08/16/2013 05:40 PM, Bin Wang wrote:
> Will it support protobuf(https://github.com/basho/erlang_protobuffs),
> I cannot compile *.proto file from src/ with erlang.mk.

That's a good question. I probably would merge such a patch right now, 
but if it ends up being too many different compilers we'll probably need 
a better solution (something like having you include both erlang.mk and 
protobuffs.mk to enable it?).

I don't use protobuffs myself so don't count on me though.

-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From jeremy at quarkgames.com  Fri Aug 16 18:29:36 2013
From: jeremy at quarkgames.com (Jeremy Ong)
Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2013 09:29:36 -0700
Subject: [99s-extend] [erlang-questions] [ANN] erlang.mk build tool
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]>
 <CAJNb-9qrsb=pdXziwNiOa5EF12e3QieMyj0N6OdzGY=-0CCz=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
 <[email protected]>
 <CAD_32VXteDmb218jRdJcabGSrc7zUvuTpxov+Os=D07Ce5pSZQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <CAKD1GY6F-+Zo7jpSM6rJrZkAypwaazh=ZBg+Q0_YY5MyXeK2XQ@mail.gmail.com>

I'd prefer it if there were more generalized hooks for files of
different names rather than hardcoding usage of a particular library.
In the case of protobuffers, some people use piqi, others use basho's
library, and still others use their own library.

On Fri, Aug 16, 2013 at 8:55 AM, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:
> On 08/16/2013 05:40 PM, Bin Wang wrote:
>>
>> Will it support protobuf(https://github.com/basho/erlang_protobuffs),
>> I cannot compile *.proto file from src/ with erlang.mk.
>
>
> That's a good question. I probably would merge such a patch right now, but
> if it ends up being too many different compilers we'll probably need a
> better solution (something like having you include both erlang.mk and
> protobuffs.mk to enable it?).
>
> I don't use protobuffs myself so don't count on me though.
>
>
> --
> Lo?c Hoguin
> Erlang Cowboy
> Nine Nines
> http://ninenines.eu
> _______________________________________________
> Extend mailing list
> Extend at lists.ninenines.eu
> http://lists.ninenines.eu:81/listinfo/extend


From wbin00 at gmail.com  Sat Aug 17 10:00:04 2013
From: wbin00 at gmail.com (Bin Wang)
Date: Sat, 17 Aug 2013 16:00:04 +0800
Subject: [99s-extend] How to broadcaset with ranch?
Message-ID: <CAD_32VWVNb_-vHChdC2S4CcFeJ29v5n3w6B0LNS5=RqWQxKaAQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

I'm new to ranch. In my application, I need to send some message to
all connections. So I'd like to know can I get all connections from
ranch, so I could use Transport:send to send them, or I must manage
all the created connections by myself? Or is there any other better
way?

Thanks.

Bin Wang


From essen at ninenines.eu  Sat Aug 17 10:10:41 2013
From: essen at ninenines.eu (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lo=EFc_Hoguin?=)
Date: Sat, 17 Aug 2013 10:10:41 +0200
Subject: [99s-extend] How to broadcaset with ranch?
In-Reply-To: <CAD_32VWVNb_-vHChdC2S4CcFeJ29v5n3w6B0LNS5=RqWQxKaAQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAD_32VWVNb_-vHChdC2S4CcFeJ29v5n3w6B0LNS5=RqWQxKaAQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>

On 08/17/2013 10:00 AM, Bin Wang wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I'm new to ranch. In my application, I need to send some message to
> all connections. So I'd like to know can I get all connections from
> ranch, so I could use Transport:send to send them, or I must manage
> all the created connections by myself? Or is there any other better
> way?

The best way to do that is on your end, using gproc properties. When the 
connection is accepted, register the process with the property and use 
the property to send messages to all processes. You don't need to 
unregister when the connection ends, gproc does that automatically.

The hackish way to do that would be to call supervisor:which_children on 
the ranch_conns_sup supervisor of your listener, but that will slow down 
the accepting of new connections, so don't do this if you need high 
accept rates.

-- 
Lo?c Hoguin
Erlang Cowboy
Nine Nines
http://ninenines.eu


From seancribbs at gmail.com  Wed Aug 21 05:18:19 2013
From: seancribbs at gmail.com (Sean Cribbs)
Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2013 22:18:19 -0500
Subject: [99s-extend] [erlang-questions]  How to broadcaset with ranch?
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
References: <CAD_32VWVNb_-vHChdC2S4CcFeJ29v5n3w6B0LNS5=RqWQxKaAQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <CAPGJuCaYJnOn-Hq_GgQZV2pxmaUwCxbS372dapbnQiOZ8vWC=w@mail.gmail.com>

This is exactly the sort of thing gen_event is for. I would make each
server process register a handler at startup using
gen_event:add_sup_handler() and then have the handle_event callback simply
relay the event to the server processes. Yes, gproc can do this, but why
incur its extra features and overhead?


On Sat, Aug 17, 2013 at 3:10 AM, Lo?c Hoguin <essen at ninenines.eu> wrote:

> On 08/17/2013 10:00 AM, Bin Wang wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I'm new to ranch. In my application, I need to send some message to
>> all connections. So I'd like to know can I get all connections from
>> ranch, so I could use Transport:send to send them, or I must manage
>> all the created connections by myself? Or is there any other better
>> way?
>>
>
> The best way to do that is on your end, using gproc properties. When the
> connection is accepted, register the process with the property and use the
> property to send messages to all processes. You don't need to unregister
> when the connection ends, gproc does that automatically.
>
> The hackish way to do that would be to call supervisor:which_children on
> the ranch_conns_sup supervisor of your listener, but that will slow down
> the accepting of new connections, so don't do this if you need high accept
> rates.
>
> --
> Lo?c Hoguin
> Erlang Cowboy
> Nine Nines
> http://ninenines.eu
>
> ______________________________**_________________
> erlang-questions mailing list
> erlang-questions at erlang.org
> http://erlang.org/mailman/**listinfo/erlang-questions<http://erlang.org/mailman/listinfo/erlang-questions>
>
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